Thread: the faith in a religion

You know!!! Kim Clement...the fruitcake who prophesied that no US soldier was going to be killed in Iraq.

Originally Posted by Mr. A

You know!!! Kim Clement...the fruitcake who prophesied that no US soldier was going to be killed in Iraq.

I do not remember him prophesying this, or maybe you misunderstood. Either way, this may give us a little insight to your disdain towards him. I for one was curious and now I think I'm understanding a bit more.

God bless you Mr. A.

Monica

CD went so far as to completely ignore Clement's own words that "not one of them would be inflicted." 3300+ later and they're still being killed and afflicted, but brushed it all aside because she found one good story. Silly.

I did not ignore it, and I take VERY seriously things of a prophetic nature. I read the word you posted about and took it to mean exactly what it said:

I spoke about certain attacks planned against the soldiers and the fact that God would protect them so that not one of them would be inflicted.

to me, this is an accurate statement. He did not say that there would be no on inflicted at all in ALL of the attacks but that there would be certain attacks planned against our troops and in THOSE ATTACKS none would be inflicted. Perhaps I am misinterpreting this, but that is for God to judge...I am accountable to my husband and to God. That is biblical. Christ is Head of His Body (the Church) and my husband is head over me. Why are YOU so set against any Word coming out of his mouth???

Look, it seems rather obvious that no matter what I say or how many proofs I offer, you have your mind made up, and so I don't think there's anything else I can add. I've given you more than enough to look at and you consistently take me out of context or only focus on that which seems to prove your point. This bears the mark of insincerity.

Quite frankly, if you were as accountable to God as you say you were, then the only logical conclusion from God's Word that you could reach is that he's a false prophet. It's that simple.

That being said, in the case of a reval, I would therefore suggest that you support him whole-heartedly. He'll appreciate it, and it'll help draw a distinction between those who want to follow God from those who want to follow the ways of the world.

Mr. A,
I respect you as a person with his or her individual right to your opinion. I just don't appreciate your judgementalism, and attempt to tell me where to give my money...I am accountable to God, we all are, Lord help us, for every vain word that comes out of our mouths...Lord knows I have a list as long as the Nile River of Vain words spoken, may God forgive me of all of them...

However, I WILL CONTINUE to post as the Lord leads me to post, and will continue to share whatever He leads me to share, and those who disagree can disagree but like I said before, EVEN though I do not understand every Word he has posted, I WILL NOT CALL HIM A FALSE PROPHET...Sorry. I am not sharing those words to pump HIM up, but I believe he is speaking words of the Lord, therefore I want to hear what the Spirit is saying....don't read them anymore if you disagree.

Also, I plan on giving to my local pastor, and to ministries that feed hungry children...or to ministries that will help Jews return to Israel. I plan on OBEYING GOD in my giving....

be blessed.

[quote=cooldolphins;198791]Mr. A,
I respect you as a person with his or her individual right to your opinion. I just don't appreciate your judgementalism, and attempt to tell me where to give my money...I am accountable to God, we all are, Lord help us, for every vain word that comes out of our mouths...Lord knows I have a list as long as the Nile River of Vain words spoken, may God forgive me of all of them...

However, I WILL CONTINUE to post as the Lord leads me to post, and will continue to share whatever He leads me to share, and those who disagree can disagree but like I said before, EVEN though I do not understand every Word he has posted, I WILL NOT CALL HIM A FALSE PROPHET...Sorry. I am not sharing those words to pump HIM up, but I believe he is speaking words of the Lord, therefore I want to hear what the Spirit is saying....don't read them anymore if you disagree.

Also, I plan on giving to my local pastor, and to ministries that feed hungry children...or to ministries that will help Jews return to Israel. I plan on OBEYING GOD in my giving....

be blessed Good point, everyone who believes in the Lord Jesus Christ is considered Gods annointed. Yet, we are not called to sow discord among the bretheren.

Thanks, RB.
I am not trying to sow discord....I just wanted to share a prophetic word that I find to be VERY exciting....and I claim what ever favor may be coming our way this month...in Jesus' name.

I don't ever recall ever making a comment about how sensitive I was or wasn't to the Holy Spirit. So where did that come from? What I am doing is comparing what you profess to God's Word, and you're lacking.

It came from MY sensitivity to the Holy Spirit, knowing He does not attack or condemn the way you have done, and if you were sensitive to Him, YOU would know how to speak to another fellow Christian properly.

I understand your attempt to shield or protect others from false prophets. I am not saying there are NONE, for I believe they abound. Can you name ONE prophet today we should listen to and pay attention to? People that are heresy hunters do not believe there are true prophets today AT ALL. You put out some good links for people to form their own judgement about Kim themselves. Let's leave it at that.

I have continually used God's Word as the standard, and you say that I'm attacking and condemning. Yet, you turn right around and indirectly insinuate that I'm a heresy hunter.

One final question. A response isn't required. If you believe that there are false prophets today, in fact many of them, then by what standard do you judge them? I mean, the two main chapters in the Bible that teach us how to discern them you disregard to justify Kim Clement. And so I was just curious to know what chapter or verses you do use?

Moving along, between posts I prayed that the Lord would minister to you about the problem or situation or whatever it is that's afflicting you or your family(?). Tomorrow when I wake, probably after I brush my teeth though , I will pray one more time. I pray you find peace with your situation.

You want to leave it alone, okay. We'll leave it alone. Adieu.

Matt. 7:15-20

15"Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves. 16By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? 17Likewise every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. 18A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit. 19Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them.

Discern by Fruits, Not Gifts

True prophets obey Jesus' teachings. Like the false prophets of old (Jer 6:13-14; 8:11; 23:13-17; Ezek 13:1-16; Mic 3:5-8), those Matthew warns against in 7:15 probably proclaim a gospel of false peace, an easy way that neglects God's true demands (vv. 13-14; France 1985:147). Matthew elsewhere warns against false prophets (7:22; 24:5, 24) and apostate Christians and leaders in the church (24:12, 48-51). Jesus elsewhere applies the present denunciations of fruitless trees against the religious leaders of his day (12:33; compare 3:8, 10; 21:19; 23:3), but because his words in this context address prophets (which most Pharisees thought no longer existed in their day), one suspects that Matthew wants Christians of his own generation to take notice.
Jesus' words are not only polemic against enemies of the faith from the outside; they are also warnings to us who claim to be Jesus' followers. We dare not restrict the title "hypocrites" to Jesus' religious contemporaries (6:2, 5, 16; pace Did. 8:1-2); God's subsequent servants may share the same fate (24:51). This passage presents us with several lessons.
False Prophets and Their Teaching Pose a Real Danger to Believers (7:15)
They are like hungry wolves who disguise themselves as sheep. People in Jesus' day could disguise themselves in sheepskins in the hope of being taken for stray dogs or other animals (Jos. War 3.192). Jesus' image is, however, more graphic than that, employing hyperbole: wolves do not wear clothes, and changing one's hide was a metaphor for the impossible (Jer 13:23; Jub. 37:20). By coming in sheep's clothing, the false prophets pretend to be sheep (Acts 20:29-30) though they are in fact hungry wolves who have come to prey on sheep (compare Mt 10:16).
Some denominations that once evangelized peoples and held orthodox teachings now encompass a much wider range of moral and spiritual teaching, and many movements that remain orthodox in general nevertheless remain susceptible to dangerous winds of doctrine. We who should be challenging unjust reasoning in the world instead often find ourselves fighting a defensive battle within our own ranks. For the sake of the flock, we must exercise discernment, especially within the church.
Evaluate Prophets by Their Fruits (7:16-20) These false prophets (v. 15) claim to have prophesied, exorcised and effected miracles by Jesus' name (v. 22). Although Matthew is surely charismatic in a positive way (compare, for example, 5:12; 10:8, 40-42; 23:34), here he challenges false Christian charismatics whose disobedience Christ will finally reveal (10:26). Although some could prophesy and work signs by demonic power (for example, 2 Thess 2:9; Rev 13:13-16; compare Jer 2:8; 23:13), one could also manifest genuine gifts of God's Spirit yet be lost (1 Sam 19:24).
Once we acknowledge that God can inspire people to speak his message (and this would apply to gifts like teaching as well as prophecy), how do we discern his genuine representatives? Like his follower Paul, Jesus subordinates the gifts of the Spirit to the fruit of the Spirit (compare 1 Cor 13) and submission to Jesus' lordship (1 Cor 12:1-3). Jesus' words about fruit thus refer to repentant works (Mt 7:21; 3:8, 10), recalling Jesus' ethical teachings in 5:21-7:12.
Much of today's church may miss out on prophecy altogether, which is not a healthy situation (1 Thess 5:20). Prophecy remains a valid gift until Jesus' return (1 Cor 13:9-12), and we should seek it for our churches (1 Cor 14:1, 39; Grudem 1982; Keener 1996:79-130). But wherever the real is practiced, the counterfeit will also appear (a phenomenon I as a charismatic have witnessed frequently; compare 1 Cor 14:29; 1 Thess 5:21).
An adulterous minister may exhibit many divinely bestowed gifts-sometimes because God is answering the prayers of people in the congregation-but such ministers are unworthy of our trust as God's spokespersons as long as they continue in sin. Yet Jesus wants us to look even closer to home. Do we become so occupied with "the Lord's work" that we lose sight of the precious people God has called us to serve? Do we become so preoccupied with our mission and our gifts that we neglect a charitable attitude toward our families and other people around us?
Yet the image of the tree and the fruit also reminds us that behavior flows from character, and in Christian teaching character comes through being born again rather than merely through self-discipline (see Odeberg 1964:72). Our own best efforts at restructuring unregenerate human nature are doomed to failure (Gal 5:19-21). By contrast, a person transformed by and consistently dependent on the power of God's Spirit will live according to the traits of God's character because of God's empowerment, just as trees bear fruit according to their own kind (Gal 5:18, 22-23).
God Will Expose Our Hearts on the Day of Judgment (7:21-23)
Some people claim to accept Jesus as a great teacher, but no more than a teacher. Yet a central component of Jesus' teaching is the revelation of his identity, and in this passage as in Matthew 25:31-46, Jesus claims the role of final judge.
Churchgoers today are no more automatically saved than those who ate with Jesus in the past (as is often noted, attending a church no more makes one a Christian than entering a garage makes one a car). Not those who claim to "know" Jesus but only those who do the Father's will have any claim on Jesus (12:50). Jesus thus borrows biblical language for righteous enmity toward the wicked (Ps 6:8; 119:115) to banish them from his presence (Mt 7:23; compare 7:19). I never knew you is a formal repudiation of the person (25:12; compare 26:70, 72, 74; France 1985:149).

BibleGateway.com- Commentaries » Matthew

Thanks for the prayers. He is taking care of me in the midst of hell on earth at times.