Hmmm :roll: , are there many Amish residents after all with BTI?? :twisted:
Yup, that was also a joke...take it as a hitchride quip during the free ride... :wink:
YB.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...ds/Rainbow.gif
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Hmmm :roll: , are there many Amish residents after all with BTI?? :twisted:
Yup, that was also a joke...take it as a hitchride quip during the free ride... :wink:
YB.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...ds/Rainbow.gif
There is no secret about the [email protected] e-mail address I would think.
Jan
Quote:
Originally Posted by azmia
Thats funny....
No one wants to answer this. ROLCLUB is going to start charging but I haven't heard anyone complaining about that. :lol: :lol:
That is because we are not discussing it yet....It has been postponed due to the hijacking of our forum...
See this link: http://www.rolclub.com/viewtopic.php?t=2411
Didn't PicPay merchants get paid until May 2005? So wouldn't Billy have been able to receive some monies, IF he requested them?
Additionally, didn't he say before switching over to BTI, that he had been paid for all memberships, except for about 500 people?
So was it, I didn't receive any? Or I receive most?
Yes 4dt, everything you stated is correct. He received payments from all but 500 people. And out of this 500, how many actually did not pay with PicPay?
Has anyone heard more from the group that was speaking with an attorney? Wondering if any more were jumping on the bandwagon?
Quote:
Originally Posted by 4dataxman
Yes, 4dataxman, that is correct. Jan wrote an excellent post on this very subject.
Also, to answer your question regarding the group who retained counsel: it is a group who live in close proximity and who originally became friends through PIPS - - meetings, social gatherings, etc. I have been rather busy of late, but will make contact to see how all is proceeding. I'm sure other members, if interested, can also form a group(s) and retain legal counsel, if they so desire.
If my understanding was right I remember Bill saying that all the Membership Monies were going to be invested in the 2% programs to grow into a large sum to be withdrawn later to benefit Pips USA and its Members with Insurance etc. I was wondering the same thing because I sent him my Picpay way back in Oct. 2005, so if he withdrew any funds back then it should have paid my Membership but he claims that he didn't get anything.Quote:
Originally Posted by 4dataxman
The people that really got screwed were the ones that paid with Paypal etc.
This was sent to me, I guess from Billy regarding this..
To All BTI Members,
The commencement of dues payments has been the topic of discussion off and
on now since the end of July when PIPS USA officially closed and
BreakThroughs International opened its doors to membership. In this email
to membership I want to communicate the current position and situation and
what has gone into that decision. Although hundreds and hundreds of
members totally understand it.. remembered joining BTI knowing that dues
would start at the end of August, feel there is value and want to support
BTI in what is essentially its start up, there are many others who either
feel that they should not have to pay any additional dues beyond what they
paid to PIPS USA. Also some are in a position where at this time they just
can't afford to pay dues. I would like to have a solution that provides
something for everyone at every level. Right or wrong.. like it or not.
this issue has done everything from causing headaches and arguments among
members to having people in here and in other forums vilify me as
everything from a money-grubbing opportunist to some sort of conspirator
in the shut down of PIPS,. This vilification is unfounded, undeserved, and
ridiculous but seems to be part of the nature of the beast within the
populations of any internet based group program or forum. This is
especially true with a population of people who are hoping against hope
for the resurrection of a program that we all believed in so strongly and
which currently has so many people feeling let down, scared and even
betrayed.
However I think a communication regarding this is in order.
When a one-time dues concept was presented, it was proposed and created
contingent upon the ability of PIPS to endure and allow those dues to grow
within that program to create the capital to operate an association that
could grow and mature and start providing more and more value, services
and support to the members of the association. In St. Louis and in
Chicago and in communications with members it was made clear that this was
dependent up on the life of PIPS as a program and that as long as it was
alive and operating as promised there would be no further dues needed.
The entity was a member of PIPS just like everyone else and in those
meetings I stated that in this concept. we as members had put our trust in
PIPS and that appropriately the association was doing so also. I even used
the phrase that we would all "Live by the PIPS and Die by the PIPS". As
far as members paying by PicPay or PayPal.. so much of the PayPal was
exchanged for PicPay and put into PIPS that it was decided NOT to make a
distinction between " good money and bad money" when closing PIPS USA and
providing Coupons for the initial membership fee for BTI. The exceptions
were those transaction from June 8th forward in PicPay. Unfortunately
that meant that BTI opened with NO source of income other than membership
fees and dues from those who joined from the group that had used PicPay
after June 8th. With NO PIPS holdings and NO income it was said at the
point of start up that by the end of August or beginning of September ,
unless PIPS could pay our outstanding withdrawals dues would need to be
implemented. It was also stated at that time that since we were all in the
position of having been overly dependent upon PIPs and essentially had NO
pips income to diversify with, new programs and opportunities would need
to be explored.. starting from scratch. At this point I will also
reiterate what I have said several times.. " If PIPS is allowed to come
back up and is allowed to restructure where we have even HALF the value
that was outstanding at the time it shut down, then this whole point
becomes moot and ongoing dues would not be necessary.
For months there has been no income to the association nor to me
personally. I don't expect people to really care about that because I am
not the only one in that position. However I have gone through the
opening of BTI and spent 70 - 80+ hours a week trying to create a
community that can be positive and move forward constructively, hoping for
PIPS to restructure and return, but not betting on it, and moving forward
to enter different programs, hoping to build again from scratch. To
continue to do so takes income.. several members were surveyed and that is
how the dues figure was determined. It was known that not everyone would
be able to do it, but in order to stay operating and providing a community
like this, at some point staff members need to be hired here ( one has been
hired part time) , rent and expenses need to be paid and some opportunity
to reward moderators and support people who volunteer needs to be
available. The ability to provide some services for members needs to be
supported by the resources and capital to do so and from my perspective it
seems like everyone feels entitled to any benefits and services involved..
not everyone feels that they should have to pay for them or support them
in one way or another. To provide the necessary income there either has
to be dues, or BTI has to be totally self sufficient and self funding.
Several members recommended as an alternative to dues, that BTI take the
lead in programs that are made available to members.to try to create a
self sufficiency that could hopefully, eventually eliminate the need for
income through ongoing dues payments. So that direction has been taken but
it is just beginning.
Add to this picture that in the interest of members, a convention in San
Diego was contracted for, funds put in a management account with the event
management firm for downpayments, expense payments etc and then due to
circumstances totally out of our control the event had to be cancelled.
This cancellation left PIPS USA with a bill from the resort for
$102,000.00 as the resort argues that what happened with PIPS in their
opinion does not fit the description of "events out of our control".
So.. now left with NO income and a bill for $102,000.00 that was the
result of totally focusing on providing things for members, something
needs to be done. This bill needs to be addressed and resources for moving
forward need to be generated. I had put my recruiting practice on hold to
start this at the request of many people, members have constantly told me
that they get FAR more value than they had ever paid for and even said the
dues should be more. However, when a new association is created in an
attempt to cure all these ills and provide direction, camaraderie and
support for members starting over so we can BreakThrough all these
disadvantages, we get people who get extremely ugly about the idea of
paying $10.00 per month to be part of the community while it goes through
its start up and gets on its feet. I will again state. as I have when we
kicked off programs, that if BTI can become self sufficient through its
position in various programs.. then I would like to implement a One-time
membership fee/dues concept within BTI. However, programs have just been
introduced and it seems that many people look FIRST to how much BTI might
benefit from it rather than looking at how they themselves can benefit
them with a little effort and teamwork.
It is correct that if every member in BTI paid their dues it could create
an income for BTI of $20,000+ per month or $240,000.00+ per year. but
those of you who have run small businesses know that that is not a large
income when you have rent, phones, expenses, employees, taxes etc and want
to do anything for growth at all. At times it makes me wonder why I don't
just call a couple of my bank clients and my publishing client whose
search assignments I have refused, generate about $150,000.00 in placement
fees over the next few months, stop using personal funds and just close BTI
or turn it into a newsletter and place the funds from my recruiting fees
into trade and just worry about myself. I enjoy too many of the members
to do that.. and have welcomed both the challenges and support I have
received in doing this. Someone told me recently that it does not cost
$100,000+ per year to run a website. Depending on the website that is
true.. but this is not just a website and I would like it to grow into a
full fledged association and a LOT of hours and work have gone into trying
to help and support members, respond to emails, answer questions, etc.
Later you will see an email from me that will be a follow up on the
Founders' Rewards Membership poll that I did last week. If an initiative
like this could be successfully implemented it would provide membership
revenue at a level that would allow BTI to enter some ventures in a
fashion that makes me confident that we could provide all those benefits
to the members and with profit participation would allow us to provide
rewards to those members equal to or in excess of what they had paid for
their membership by April 1st and that amount again in rewards on or
before October 1st, 2006 and also have the support given to BTI by those
memberships to eliminate the need for ongoing dues for all members.
There was also a suggestion by a couple of members that if a member
participates in a program that provides BTI with a least the amount of
monthly revenue that would equal the ongoing dues payment ,that their
participation in that program could replace the requirement of paying
dues. This could be a bookkeeping nightmare but could be a consideration.
Many see the value in BTI and are willing to pay the dues but then also
recommend creative ways of doing the equivalent in a way that helps the
member and also helps BTI.
So as it is right now. revenue in dues or program income is needed and in
the next few days I would love to hear recommendations and creative
thoughts from Members on how to achieve this goal in a fashion that
members can wholeheartedly support and embrace.. I know there is NO
solution that will make EVERYONE happy.. but I am all ears when it comes
to ideas from membership who understand that BTI has to have revenue.. and
members need income too.
If you have suggestions I will be watching them over the next 48 hours
at a special email address. Email your suggestions to [email protected]
Thank you once again.
Bill