Thread: who is this man?

What do you mean who is this man ? It's really Jesus or somebody else really no matter what like for example prophet Muhhamad, correct ? There are very long texts you have provided and then so be it anyway. See my point ? I hope you really do.

Originally Posted by Mogas

What do you mean who is this man ? It's really Jesus or somebody else really no matter what like for example prophet Muhhamad, correct ? There are very long texts you have provided and then so be it anyway. See my point ? I hope you really do.

thank you
Yes, I mean that Jesus peace be upon him the prophet of God and not God or the Son of God
The title explains the meaning of the content
Bible Scholar Dr Zakir Naik proves Jesus never became a God on - TheDeenShow
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x3rCowIKzYU

The calendar year of Islam begins not with the birthday of our prophet (peace be on him), not from the time that the revelation came to him (Bethat) nor from the time of his ascension to heaven, but with the migration (Hijra) from an undesirable environment into a desirable place to fulfill Allah's command. It was migration from a plot that was set by the leaders of the Quraysh who were plotting to kill prophet Muhammad, and to destroy the truth that today is being conveyed to mankind everywhere against tyranny and injustice. Their purpose was to destroy the foundation of the Islamic state, the Sunnah of the tradition of the prophet, and to prevent the revelation being delivered by Allah's messenger to mankind.


The Islamic calendar is reckoned from the time of migration (Hijra) of Prophet Mohammad (Peace Be Upon Him) from Mecca to Madina. The Prophet's decision to migrate from Mecca came after several years of inhuman treatment of the faithful by the powerful tribes who were united despite all their feuds to stop the spread of Islam.

Prophet Mohammad's decision to leave Mecca coincided with the infidel's plan to assassinate him. In 622 AD, the Quresh tribesmen held a meeting and decided that a band of young men, one from each tribe, should assassinate Prophet Mohammad collectively so that their responsibility for the murder could not be placed on any particular tribe.

On the eventful night, the Prophet asked his cousin Ali Ben Abutalib to take his place in bed to make the Meccans think that he was asleep. The Prophet himself slipped out unobserved alongwith his loyal follower Abu Bakr (who was chosen as the first C aliph after the death of the prophet). They secretly made their way to a cave named Thawr, not far from Mecca and lay in hiding there for a day or two until Abu Bakr's son reported that the search for him had been given up. Then the two set out from Madina on camel back. They reached Quba, on the edge of the Madina oasis, on 12th Rabiul Awwal. With Mohammad's arrival in Quba a new phase of his career and glory of Islam started.

This migration has a special significance in the history of Islam. It ended the Meccan period of humiliation and torture and began the era of success. His own people to whom he preached Islam for 13 years neglected the Prophet of Islam. But he was cordially received in Madina as an honored chief.

In Madina his power enhanced day by day. Here he was not only the religious leader but took the role of a politician and statesman too. Prophet Mohammad expired ten years after his migration to Madina but only in one decade he changed the course of human history.

In view of this special significance of the Prophet's migration the consultative body advised the Second Islamic Caliph, Omar ben Khattab, to start the Islamic year from the date of migration of the Prophet from Mecca to Madina.

According to early Moslem scholars, Abu Musa Al Shari drew attention of Omar to an improperly dated debenture or IOU which was payable in the month of Shaban but it was not clear which Shaban was actually meant, the present one or the coming one. Omar called the dignitaries for consultation who made several suggestions to begin the Islamic calendar.

Ali (who later became the fourth caliph) suggested the Hijra as the beginning of the Islamic year with Moharram as its first month. Consequently, Caliph Omar in 21 A.H. or 641 A.D introduced the Islamic calendar in its present form.

QURANIC GUIDANCE

The guidance about the Islamic calendar is taken from the following verses from the Holy Quran: (In the name of GOD most gracious and most merciful)

"Lo the number of the months with God is twelve months." IX:36.

"They ask thee, of new moons. Say: They are fixed seasons for mankind and for the pilgrimage." II:189.

"He it is who appointed the sun a splendor and the moon a light, and measured for her stages, that ye might know the number of the years, and the reckoning." X:5

The Islamic Calendar of 12 Lunar Months is determined by observation of the new moon with no effort by intercalation (addition) or other means to synchronize the Lunar year with the Solar year.

Seerah of Prophet Muhammed 27 - The Hijrah - Emigration to Madinah - Yasir Qadhi | March 2012

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=utKZzIWZ0I4

There are several key verses which Christians use to prove the biblical origin of the Trinity. Upon analysis of these verses, one can clearly see that they do not prove the Trinity, but rather the same monotheistic message of God. One of the most frequently cited passages from the Bible is Isaiah 9:6-7, from which Christians conclude that the Messiah must be God incarnate. The passage states:

“or a child will be born to us, a son will be given to us; And the government will rest on His shoulders; And His name will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Eternal Father, Prince of Peace. There will be no end to the increase of His government or of peace, on the throne of David and over his kingdom, to establish it and to uphold it with justice and righteousness from then on and forevermore the zeal of the Lord of hosts will accomplish this.”

That Isaiah 9:6 has been misinterpreted can be seen from the fact that Jesus is never called the “Eternal Father” anywhere else in Bible. Since the Trinitarian doctrine teaches that Christians should “neither confound the Persons nor divide the Substance” (Athanasian Creed), how can the Trinitarians accept that Jesus is the “Eternal Father”? Let us consider additional facts impartially.

First, all the Hebrew verb forms in Isaiah 9:6 are in the past tense. For example, the word which the Christian Bibles render as “his name will be called” is the two words ‘vayikra shemo,’ which properly translated, should read “his name was called.” The word “vayikra” is the first word to appear in the book of Leviticus (1:1), and it is translated properly over there – in the past tense. In addition, the King James Version translates the same verbs elsewhere in the past tense in Genesis 4:26 and Isaiah 5:25. Only in Isaiah 9:6-7 are these verbs translated in the future tense!

Notice that it says “a child HAS been born to us.” This is an event that has just occurred, not a future event. Isaiah is not making a prophecy, but recounting history. A future event would say a child will be born to us, but this is NOT what the verse says. The Christian translations capitalize the word ‘son’ assuming that this is a messianic prophecy and the names of a divine son.

Second, the two letter word “is”, is usually not stated in Hebrew. Rather, “is” is understood. For example, the words “hakelev” (the dog) and “gadol” (big), when joined into a sentence - hakelev gadol - means “the dog IS big,” even though no Hebrew word in that sentence represents the word “is.” A more accurate translation of the name of that child, then, would be “A wonderful counselor is the mighty God, the everlasting father ...”. This name describes God, not the person who carries the name. The name Isaiah itself means “God is salvation,” but no one believes the prophet himself is God in a human body!

Third, the phrase “Mighty God” is a poor translation according to some biblical scholars. Although English makes a clear distinction between “God” and “god,” the Hebrew language, which has only capital letters, cannot. The Hebrew word “God” had a much wider range of application than it does in English. Some suggest a better translation for the English reader would be “mighty hero,” or “divine hero.” Both Martin Luther and James Moffatt translated the phrase as “divine hero” in their Bibles.

Fourth, according to the New Testament, Jesus was never called any of these names in his lifetime.

Fifth, if Isaiah 9:6 is taken to refer to Jesus, then Jesus is the Father! And this is against the Trinitarian doctrine.

Sixth, the fact that the New Testament does not quote this passage shows that even the New Testament authors didn’t take this verse to be in reference to Jesus.

Seventh, the passage is talking about the wonders performed by the Lord for Hezekiah, king of Judah. Preceding verses in Isaiah 9 talk of a great military triumph by Israel over its enemies. At the time Isaiah is said to have written this passage, God had just delivered King Hezekiah and Jerusalem from a siege laid by the Assyrians under General Sennacherib. The deliverance is said to have been accomplished in spectacular fashion: an angel went into the Assyrian camp and killed 185,000 soldiers while they slept. When Sennacherib awoke to find his army decimated, he and the remaining soldiers fled, where he was assassinated by his own sons (Isaiah 37:36-3. Chapters 36 and 37 of Isaiah recount how Hezekiah stood firm in the face of Sennacherib’s vast army and his blasphemous words against the God. When all seemed lost, Hezekiah continued to trust in the Lord, and for this he was rewarded with a miraculous victory. It is interesting to note that the statement, “the zeal of the Lord of hosts will accomplish this,” found at the end of Isaiah 9:7, is found in only two other places in the Bible: Isaiah 37:32 and 2 Kings 19:31. Both these passages discuss the miraculous deliverance of Hezekiah by God. Therefore, in light of the above, Isaiah is recounting God’s defense of Jerusalem during the Assyrian siege. Furthermore, Soncino’s commentary says the chapter is about the fall of Assyria and the announcement of the birth of Hezekiah, the son of Ahaz.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rl_VVivr1dc
Ahmed Deedat exposes the Trinity to the public.flv

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=20GEBV1cEzA

لمن تصلي؟ هاشم في حوار مع مسيحي الجزء الأول
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5jM7QJaCI0U

لمن تصلي؟ هاشم في حوار مع مسيحي الجزء الثانى
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZIPxB97vudU
لمن تصلي؟ هاشم في حوار مع مسيحي الجزء الثالث
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EUJ5_TOgsyY
لمن تصلي؟ هاشم في حوار مع مسيحي الجزء االاخير
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WuY4v8K7efA

There are several key verses which Christians use to prove the biblical origin of the Trinity. Upon analysis of these verses, one can clearly see that they do not prove the Trinity, but rather the same monotheistic message of God. One of the most frequently cited passages from the Bible is Isaiah 9:6-7, from which Christians conclude that the Messiah must be God incarnate. The passage states:

“or a child will be born to us, a son will be given to us; And the government will rest on His shoulders; And His name will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Eternal Father, Prince of Peace. There will be no end to the increase of His government or of peace, on the throne of David and over his kingdom, to establish it and to uphold it with justice and righteousness from then on and forevermore the zeal of the Lord of hosts will accomplish this.”

That Isaiah 9:6 has been misinterpreted can be seen from the fact that Jesus is never called the “Eternal Father” anywhere else in Bible. Since the Trinitarian doctrine teaches that Christians should “neither confound the Persons nor divide the Substance” (Athanasian Creed), how can the Trinitarians accept that Jesus is the “Eternal Father”? Let us consider additional facts impartially.

First, all the Hebrew verb forms in Isaiah 9:6 are in the past tense. For example, the word which the Christian Bibles render as “his name will be called” is the two words ‘vayikra shemo,’ which properly translated, should read “his name was called.” The word “vayikra” is the first word to appear in the book of Leviticus (1:1), and it is translated properly over there – in the past tense. In addition, the King James Version translates the same verbs elsewhere in the past tense in Genesis 4:26 and Isaiah 5:25. Only in Isaiah 9:6-7 are these verbs translated in the future tense!

Notice that it says “a child HAS been born to us.” This is an event that has just occurred, not a future event. Isaiah is not making a prophecy, but recounting history. A future event would say a child will be born to us, but this is NOT what the verse says. The Christian translations capitalize the word ‘son’ assuming that this is a messianic prophecy and the names of a divine son.

Second, the two letter word “is”, is usually not stated in Hebrew. Rather, “is” is understood. For example, the words “hakelev” (the dog) and “gadol” (big), when joined into a sentence - hakelev gadol - means “the dog IS big,” even though no Hebrew word in that sentence represents the word “is.” A more accurate translation of the name of that child, then, would be “A wonderful counselor is the mighty God, the everlasting father ...”. This name describes God, not the person who carries the name. The name Isaiah itself means “God is salvation,” but no one believes the prophet himself is God in a human body!

Third, the phrase “Mighty God” is a poor translation according to some biblical scholars. Although English makes a clear distinction between “God” and “god,” the Hebrew language, which has only capital letters, cannot. The Hebrew word “God” had a much wider range of application than it does in English. Some suggest a better translation for the English reader would be “mighty hero,” or “divine hero.” Both Martin Luther and James Moffatt translated the phrase as “divine hero” in their Bibles.

Fourth, according to the New Testament, Jesus was never called any of these names in his lifetime.

Fifth, if Isaiah 9:6 is taken to refer to Jesus, then Jesus is the Father! And this is against the Trinitarian doctrine.

Sixth, the fact that the New Testament does not quote this passage shows that even the New Testament authors didn’t take this verse to be in reference to Jesus.

Seventh, the passage is talking about the wonders performed by the Lord for Hezekiah, king of Judah. Preceding verses in Isaiah 9 talk of a great military triumph by Israel over its enemies. At the time Isaiah is said to have written this passage, God had just delivered King Hezekiah and Jerusalem from a siege laid by the Assyrians under General Sennacherib. The deliverance is said to have been accomplished in spectacular fashion: an angel went into the Assyrian camp and killed 185,000 soldiers while they slept. When Sennacherib awoke to find his army decimated, he and the remaining soldiers fled, where he was assassinated by his own sons (Isaiah 37:36-3. Chapters 36 and 37 of Isaiah recount how Hezekiah stood firm in the face of Sennacherib’s vast army and his blasphemous words against the God. When all seemed lost, Hezekiah continued to trust in the Lord, and for this he was rewarded with a miraculous victory. It is interesting to note that the statement, “the zeal of the Lord of hosts will accomplish this,” found at the end of Isaiah 9:7, is found in only two other places in the Bible: Isaiah 37:32 and 2 Kings 19:31. Both these passages discuss the miraculous deliverance of Hezekiah by God. Therefore, in light of the above, Isaiah is recounting God’s defense of Jerusalem during the Assyrian siege. Furthermore, Soncino’s commentary says the chapter is about the fall of Assyria and the announcement of the birth of Hezekiah, the son of Ahaz.
أحمد ديدات يفضح الثالوث عل الملأ - YouTube.flv

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rl_VVivr1dc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=20GEBV1cEzA

Someone told me
Thanks for sharing info, I know what your point is. I am just throwing my opinion.
One can’t just compare Jesus with current day Christians. One need to understand the dominant race in Christianity and their background, how they accepted this religion and how it impacted their daily lives.
Jesus was a Prophet, like Abraham, Moses and Muhammed peace be upon them.
The Christians of today's days are product of Roman Empire’s conveniently adoption of Jesus’ religion in 3rd century.
The Europeans had a mixed and scattered culture for thousands of years, with pagan beliefs and other fairy tales dominating the landscape.

With the advent of Christianity in Europe, the locals adopted the religion very quickly, as it did not confronted with their life styles and culture.
Under Constantine who imported (officially) the religion in Europe, Romans ensured that the new religion is in full compliance to their culture and rituals.
For example, during the counsel of Nicaea several aspects of belief systems were standardized before masses (of Europe, non-Semitics, Caucasians) can have a hold onto different version of Bible or common daily life practices of Orthodox Jews. The East Bazentine, new Roman Empire to the central Europe and pockets of other areas in North were mainly pagan at that time. So sculptures, divine figures, certain celebrations, festivities were part of their social life. Moral values were as good as any other region of that time (The middle-east that had Jewish population and influence on others were considered very conservatives, so you can imagine what was going on in Europe), drinking and pork eating was normal and commonly practiced.

So the importer of the new religion made sure that standards set by Bible for Isrealites must not collide with the relaxed (no restrictions) attitude of Europeans towards religion. They customized the religion to best suite the new tenants that eventually became the torch bearer of Christianity within few centuries. The original followers and preachers fell in the background and eventually forgotten. The religion totally changed and took new course where the founder died for the sins, giving followers clean chit to do whatever they do, keep His sculpture in Church, follow the re-branded customs of pagans with renewed stories linked to Jesus for every celebration and festivals, drink and eat pork as before and create excuses (from Jesus’ life) for everything that they do against the Ten Commandments.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mZI9E8sbAZ8



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=quwh5V6yXEg



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-_aMWSFoWSE





https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wLuf9BPmUz0





https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5GhlV1XXLxE



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e8YYYwCO9Ew

The idea of Jesus dying on the cross is central to the Christian belief. It represents the conviction that Jesus died for the sins of mankind. The crucifixion of Jesus is a vital doctrine in Christianity; however Muslims reject it completely. Before describing what Muslims believe about Jesus’ crucifixion, it may be useful to understand the Islamic reaction to the notion of original sin.
When Adam and Eve ate from the forbidden tree in paradise, they were not tempted by a serpent. It was Satan who deceived and cajoled them, whereupon they exercised their free will and made an error in judgement. Eve does not bear the burden of this mistake alone. Together, Adam and Eve realised their disobedience, felt remorse and begged for God’s forgiveness. God, in his infinite mercy and wisdom, forgave them. Islam has no concept of original sin; each person bears responsibility for his own deeds.


“And no bearer of burdens shall bear another’s burden”. (Quran 35:1
There is no need for God, a son of God, or even a Prophet of God to sacrifice himself for mankind’s sins in order to buy forgiveness. Islam refuses this view entirely. The foundation of Islam rests on knowing with certainty that nothing should we worshipped but God alone. Forgiveness emanates from the One True God; so, when a person seeks forgiveness, he must turn to God submissively with true remorse and beg forgiveness, promising not to repeat the sin. Then and only then will sins be forgiven.
In the light of Islam’s understanding of original sin and forgiveness, we can see that Islam teaches that Jesus did not come to atone for the sins of mankind; rather, his purpose was to reaffirm the message of the Prophets before him.
“.. None has the right to be worshipped but God, the One and the Only True God…” (Quran 3:62)
Muslims do not believe in the crucifixion of Jesus, nor do they believe that he died.


The Crucifixion
Jesus’ message was rejected by most of the Israelites as well as the Roman authorities. Those who believed formed a small band of followers around him, known as the disciples. The Israelites plotted and conspired against Jesus and formulated a plan to have him assassinated. He was to be executed in public, in a particularly gruesome manner, well known in the Roman Empire: crucifixion.
Crucifixion was considered a shameful way to die, and “citizens” of the Roman Empire were exempt from this punishment. It was designed to not only prolong the agony of death, but to mutilate the body. The Israelites planned this humiliating death for their Messiah – Jesus, the messenger of God. God in his infinite mercy prevented this abominable event by putting the resemblance of Jesus on somebody else and elevating Jesus alive, body and soul, to heaven. The Quran is silent about the exact details of just who this person was, but we know and believe with certainty that it was not Prophet Jesus.


Muslims believe that the Quran and the authentic narrations of Prophet Muhammad contain all the knowledge mankind needs in order to worship and live according to God’s commandments. Therefore, if small details are not explained, it is because God in His infinite wisdom has judged these details to be of no benefit to us. The Quran explains, in God’s own words, the conspiracy against Jesus and His plan to outwit the Israelites and raise Jesus to heaven.
“And they plotted to kill Jesus and God planned too. And God is the Best of the planners.” (Quran 3:54)
“And because of their boasting, "We killed Messiah Jesus, son of Mary, the Messenger of God." But they killed him not, nor crucified him, but the resemblance of Jesus was put over another man, and those who differ therein are full of doubts. They have no (certain) knowledge; they follow nothing but conjecture. For surely, they killed him not. But God raised him (Jesus) up unto Himself. And God is Ever All-Powerful, All-Wise.” (Quran 4:157-15

Jesus Did Not Die
The Israelites and the Roman authorities were not able to harm Jesus. God says clearly that He took Jesus up to Himself and cleared him of the false statements made in Jesus’ name.
“O Jesus! I will take you and raise you to Myself and clear you of the forged statement that Jesus is God’s son.” (Quran 3:55)
In the previous verse, when God said He “will take” Jesus, he uses the word mutawaffeeka. Without a clear understanding of the richness of the Arabic language, and knowledge of the levels of meaning in many words, it may be possible to misunderstand God’s meaning. In the Arabic language today the word mutawaffeeka is sometimes used to denote death, or even sleep. In this verse of Quran, however, the original meaning is used and the comprehensiveness of the word denotes that God raised Jesus to himself, completely. Thus, he was alive at his ascension, body and soul, without any injury or defect.


Muslims believe Jesus is not dead, and that he will return to this world in the last days before the Day of Judgement. Prophet Mohammad said to his companions:
“How will you be when the son of Mary, Jesus descends amongst you and he will judge people by the Law of the Quran and not by the law of Gospel.” (Saheeh Al-Bukhari)
God reminds us in the Quran that the Day of Judgement is a Day that we cannot avoid and cautions us that the descent of Jesus is a sign of its nearness.
“And he, Jesus, son of Mary shall be a known sign for the Hour. Therefore have no doubt concerning it. And follow Me! This is the Straight Path.” (Quran 43:61)
Therefore, the Islamic belief about Jesus’ crucifixion and death is clear. There was a plot to crucify Jesus but it did not succeed; Jesus did not die, but ascended to heaven. In the last days leading up to the Day of Judgement, Jesus will return to this world and continue
his message.
Was Jesus Crucified 3-hour debate between Dr. Zakir Naik and Pastor Rukni

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fdeUi45cl5Q

كيف يكون النبي محمداً آخر الانبياء و سيعود النبي عيسى مرة اخرى ؟ اجابة رائعة

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=loHJ_1CzZZI

One principle in the true Gospel and the Holy Koran

53. Say: "O 'Ibadi (My slaves) who have transgressed against themselves (by committing evil deeds and sins)! Despair not of the Mercy of Allah, verily Allah forgives all sins. Truly, He is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.
Surah Az-Zumar

Go directly to the Creator
He asked for forgiveness and remorse and not to return to sin again

There is no intermediary to reveal his mistakes

And take an instrument for forgiveness from the church

This is a particular delusion

Ahmed Deedat Is it permissible for a Muslim of forgiveness and entering paradise

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PDQBjjIbE3U